tv NEWS LIVE - 30 Al Jazeera March 15, 2019 10:00am-10:34am +03
hi i think during. this period of time that i've acquired oh my god i've tried. and just call the market chill i gave myself twenty five years to live for us it's always my job that's it that is a myth to because i i i the focus. to this but. forward to freedom. rene went to trial she testified but very incoherently she was hiding the trial. you know was she was not a good witness for herself she recanted right away afterwards and her confession is that as it was coerced when i talked to him about this they're like well this i
would never prosecute that's what people say i've been talking about this for thirty years and that's the first thing everybody says i get it but it wouldn't happen to me. it's not one time a person that gives a false confession we are all fall into the circumstance of interrogation we are all there have been some training detectives i've spoken to who say i can get anybody to confess to many of them will boast that they have a ninety five percent confession right but conceivable a lesser or a less you near perfect at identifying the perpetrator that is every suspect you identify is the perpetrator right if you've got a confession rate at that level you're producing a whole lot of false confessions the renee lynch when i talked to her about it she explained to me i was so shocked that they convicted me she said because there was no evidence of a confession so powerful it can stand alone so here's the jury on the one hand they've got the confessions of a woman and they're going to delay the confessions trumped the d.n.a.
changes everything it sometimes i'd like in the final product of a confession to a hollywood production it is scripted by the police theory of the case it is rehearsed and then lights action camera ready to go. and that's what the jury sees they don't see the whole production they just see the final i don't see how the judge or jury to look past a false confession if they don't see the process. her name is case we're trying to get permission to test all the old evidence from d.n.a. but to do that we have to collect as much information about her innocence as we possibly can. go back and interview old witnesses collect documents go back to the crime scene. i keep coming back to this thing that the cops knew he was in florida and kept
going with the story that they did together how can they be permitted to go forward with a serious of a case that they know is not true they made the trial basically matcher. it just makes me so jaded and really disgusted with the district attorney's office is that i feel like you know the you know they're supposed to be at the top of the chain right there it's supposed to be the ones making sure the cops made mistakes or people below the cops made mistakes then they're the ones who are responsible for fixing it why not do d.n.a. testing we're not infallible we can all make mistakes i mean renee's going to be in prison for the rest of her life why not just check in rene's case it's especially frustrating because i mean they certainly believe that this was done not the stabbing was not done by her right so there is a set i mean they're basically admitting that they have a cold case and there's
a murder out there and they still don't want to do it. we have a number of documented cases in which the person who falsely confessed actually came to believe the lie that they were told about their own behavior. which is. a whole nother level of insanity and some of them believe it for a long time afterwards right. here. we enjoy. in the melted thompson case we had he was a danish inturn who came. to danish he was a college student studying to become a teacher and he came and interned at i.p.s. which is really you know like a twenty thousand dollar a year preschool up by the un and it was a code teacher who accuses meltzer of molesting all the kids in the class and he's
on the cover of the daily news they take his focus his facebook profile pictures him with his niece on his shoulders so they put that on the cover of the daily news and write sex monster and they go arrest him in the morning and bring him into the station and they have a female cop interrogate him she tells him well you know we have video of you molesting these kids which they had videos but he's not molesting anybody so they had this woman who accused him had taken videos of him in the classroom interacting normally with children and so either the cops hadn't watched it or they had watched it and were blatantly lying to him but there was no video of him molesting kids but he hears that right and he thinks holy crap well if i'm on video i must have done it right they let him continue to believe this lie that he's caught red handed on tape molesting these kids and i think that that you know he started you could tell
through the hole when they finally are recording him he's doubting himself you know he's he's wondering did i do this. i mean you can see. he's rachel ferrari you know and i mean assistant district attorney in new york county mr johnson. can you tell me why you're here today yes. i'm here because i'm in the port of. my colleagues and. for inappropriate. behavior with kids ok so why don't you tell me probably anything how this started what happened you know what happened.
you know well that's a feel and remember this and to go around six of them was about. and then. presented me i had. missed that savings and i was at present and you know and so. i had taken. its hands during play time and playing around. and so i remember short and. you know for sure if for in that or the show or you call them. and so when you say give you pleasure at one time that was central. yeah it would have to be. i don't know you know.
my memory of this like it is not a bit of it if you read out this demand i did that's your handwriting and it just losing it over briefly because it looks like it's been changed in any way. that's your signature at the bottom here because if you read this out here today you're going to show it to the camera. i don't even think people in the u.s. really get that the police are allowed to lie to you i think most people would think that if i am speaking to a police officer he's time to the truth but now to tom's i mean in denmark it's illegal for the police to lie to you so he really i think was was you know really says extra susceptible to something like that it took us filing the civil rights suit to even get access to these tapes the district attorney wouldn't give it to us when the criminal case was pending we asked the court we moved for a court order to get it the judge just wouldn't give it to us but they sat on these
tapes for eight months he had this case hanging over his head and they knew that there was nothing in the tapes right and because was that was the only evidence there was yes luckily mel to never got convicted right we were able to stop it before that happened but it took i mean it almost killed him. my. parents found sexual abuse involving very young children were brought to the attention you know my thoughts are with us tom. if you tell everything to dismiss this case after. it's gathered in our next guest. that. is but i missed it didn't oh man it's he still in fact this awful person and what dansko was it appointed about him and its function to want it and still a c.p.a.
so he put in a treaty between the elite sport from the no one say it's going to help put the two at the end of the good cheer him system and sit for it to pass assess student forward to put in a new e.f. which is here in new york i can't for. the forefront see treating its three stories up. the most false confession cases there falsely confessing to an actual crime that they didn't commit in this case he was confessing to something that never even happened right as you said so poignantly i mean his life was ruined and he didn't even get convicted. you know the central park jogger case was my first interaction with false
confessions our firm represented corey wise on his civil rights case i'm not that's a hell of a way to start i mean you're diving right in at the deep end there yeah you know the circumstances at play in that case were huge amount of pressure on the police and the authorities to make arrests and make them stick to majors but they couldn't be infamous central park jogger case in one thousand nine hundred eighty nine the rape and beating of a female jogger made headlines nationwide the teenagers are confessed but later claimed that their confessions have been covered. when the actual perpetrator stepped forward the five men were finally exonerated but at that time for nearly seven years in prison and one of them cory was thirteen. with one of the most notorious crimes in the history of new york city it was a crime in which a woman who was a wealthy preside investment banker was out jogging at dusk and was
dragged into the woods and central park and almost beaten to death and it was front page news every day everywhere and they were out to get arrests and they got him. when you get to the false confessions in that case it was a classic you know. mismatch they were totally overmatched under represented if represented at all i don't know what they could pick or even have anyone in the room with now is going to was sixteen so he was considered an adult sadly and so his mom was not allowed in there and they you know had given them lawyers they all waived their their miranda rights. this is very very. this neighborhood we don't know.
i want to know exactly what you see and exactly right and exactly what you said. after seeing those pictures i'm sure that you can see. you know what. it is hard for people to understand how this can. help out the. could produce a confession to something they didn't do and it really is a complicated set of stories there is no one reason. you know corey wise confessed to get out of this bad situation he was under intense pressure for many many hours right he was likely be told that others were giving stories and that he needed to cooperate in order to go home and it is very telling in the central park
five case that every one of them every one of the boys and every one of the parents who were present were surprised that the boys were arrested after their statements every one of her was going home right right well you know want it sounds crazy right here thought you were going or confess to a rape and go home right but you know that when false confessors are interviewed afterward and they've been exonerated and the first question everybody wants those i don't understand why don't you confront the most typical response is because i want to go home right in this and people often say out afterwards you know i was so tired i was so stressed i figured let me sign this confession it'll all work itself out in the end the detectives often say you know we have d.n.a. we're going to send it to the lab great great they think that claiming they have to any of that bluff is a way to scare the criminal into submission it may be right but if the person you're talking to is not the criminal but an innocent person that the law becomes
a promise of future exoneration paradoxically makes it easier to confess right let me take a break we're going to do some tests we're actually quite samples from a lot of different people. right i just want to know that if we do that we will probably get an order to take a sample from you. and then we'll compare it to tests. right because you're in a position now where if you know that there's an a b. a match. that you'd be better off if you tell us about it now or the stairs instead of saying something that's natural or is this. one of the things i think they made you say was that you cut her out of the legs. how did you come up with that i don't know. came from no i don't know he just made it up i don't know it came from no i don't know. like why does someone do that right
that's what everybody wants to know and they're liable to happen to you they're welcome to devil's playground as the devil's playground because i think most people would like to think i would like to think to myself like i would never do that but did you ever say to yourself damn why did i tell these lives why do i tell these lies i put my son been in there really did not exist him i really did not exist as i would just or i just felt going to there probably exist in my world just just for the hurt that i did i said. with the mother who was with the most of them by it was a it was a room but just the glow home would guess my way nor me. i was worried it will be true it was world hardware at all. so is his shop or were. three is after the gold plated to leave the european union accept is yet to take
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a brief statement saying that it blames explicitly hamas for launching these two rockets towards tel aviv earlier that said they couldn't be sure who had launched them but hamas as always in the israeli eyes bears responsibility for whatever happens hamas and islamic jihad both having denied responsibility of carrying out this attack now the israeli military is saying that it is hamas they believe or least they are saying publicly was behind it the u.s. senate has voted to revoke donald trump that the ration of a national emergency on the border with mexico several members of the president's own republican party sided against him he says he'll veto the move president of saudi arabia's human rights commission says those responsible for the murder of journalists have been brought to justice the u.n. human rights body continues to pressure the kingdom over the treatment of detained activists but saudi arabia denies claims of torture and says their rights haven't been violated the u.k. will ask the e.u.
to extend its deadline for leaving beyond march twenty ninth after a vote was passed by parliament m.p.'s overwhelmingly voted to pass a motion brought by prime minister to resign may requesting an extension syrian government forces have shelled residential areas in southern adlib province attacks in the region have increased as beside assad's government steps up pressure on one of syria's last rebel strongholds the number of dead from airstrikes on the city on wednesday has risen to seventeen. rescue efforts have been called off in nigeria's commercial capital lagos a day after a building with a school on the top floor collapsed more than a dozen people mostly schoolchildren were killed it's feared many others are still missing france's air accident investigation agency has the black boxes from that if european airlines jet that crashed on sunday killing a hundred fifty seven people on board the u.s. federal aviation administration says old boeing seven three seven max eight and nine will remain grounded until its software is upgraded tested and installed it's
back to witness next on al-jazeera than it's the news hour also you them but i. there's a right. i bet what happens here is she says he knocks her out on the kitchen floor and they're like man doesn't work doesn't work renee not good enough didn't then he do in the living room look at this photo look at what is here oh yeah. it certainly doesn't fit with renee's no concise no i want to see a real place where. i think you heard that some wishful thinking mike i don't think
there is a real police report i mean. i just don't. maybe they sort of knew they were names confession was not so good or not true and so they didn't really want kareem because they didn't really believe that he was there . that or that it happened like that and so if they get him in that then they could end up with nobody bacon today i believe that amherst was you know in their ranking safest place in america lived oh really so their image was getting tarnished you know so became very little right. when taking on a case like rene's the danger is always the case of events or other crime scene evidence has not been preserved. if there's no crime scene evidence or case
evidence. then there's nothing to d.n.a. test and if there's no d.n.a. to. test it's extremely hard to prove that your client is innocent. that's really. right. in rene's case it was a very bloody crime scene the murder weapon was never found but there was a purse that had a bloody fingerprint in it and there was a drawer in the bedroom with a bloody fingerprint on it they d.n.a. tested some things but not those and the only d.n.a. found at the crime scene was the victims. if i mean everything you know. i think out of forty one pieces of evidence they tested seven. for d.n.a. and so you know they're in trouble right at trial because you can't get convicted
on your own confession alone so they go and they try to round up jailhouse snitches but only one who worked. so it was her confession and a jailhouse snitch which is so common in false confession cases and you have the confession and then the extra evidence because there's no physical evidence the corroboration to the confession is a snitch. my . you know little woman her name was a. long time ago. so i'm trying to get her out of prison because i don't believe that she did what she was accused of i need to talk with her how they were in bed for together thanks. or you. all are going to. come kong you are i
hope so please please because it has a name is doing twenty five to life for something she didn't do. and we really are are hitting a lot of of dead ends and rockwell's a huge going to be a huge helped us ok i'm very much thank you sir. i know by if you mean you can i have no practical ok. oh. ok then you. do you mind if i said there. is only a little bit of good that's ok do you know where. i don't have a street for you or your body will feel fine no we're trying we're trying. do you remember interacting with any of the police officers back then mr g.q.
may as june was name was very it is some of. my impression looking back that thank you all here she's guilty well she's guilty and he go make sure they do some time it was a bloody crime so now we know i was mighty a t.v. d.n.a. so these are all somebody else maybe being right how. it was one of the things that's one of the things that we hope to be able to do is retest the d.n.a. there's knowledge she has no chance some cases we get and we look at them and we even if we believe the person is innocent we can say well i mean there's just for a variety of reasons nothing we can do there's something we can do here but not a lot of people get exonerated. hello. and yeah it's just work out.
i just want to talk to you because i'm helping rene trying to get her out can we come by what do i have to just talk to me. ok thank you so much. we need to ask the most and the most important thing to so how she was to her what her actions what the police were. i would think that with young right with andrea you know in our lives for me every day and he didn't have a car with a ok good for her promise you anything like where you going to get out to let me out so we're with you right right i want to get out and so you actually did get out thank you we really appreciate it. ok so that's good that's helpful.
a young schoolteacher in denver he's fourteen years old friends when this happened and he is tiny like maybe one hundred ten pounds. or near. the overlap between meltzer and lorenzo is a mountain they tell him there's these videotapes that show him abusing children which there aren't in lorenzo's they actually go as far as to have him take his shoes off and they do this whole charade where this very angry cop comes back in with the shoe and says well i'm a shoe print expert and your shoe matches the print at the crime scene was untrue.
which. you feel. in the united states police are permitted to lie about it. and tell you right out. think long and fast about. that is a shocking discovery to most people most western countries don't permit it the u.s. supreme court permits it so consequently you have two detectives making it seem as if we have independent evidence they sometimes will get very specific about what that evidence is telling us that you are involved in something they've already started that is shaping process and the mother already is believing it we're still going to see both of you they're not ready
to say go for it isn't it is it. rather that the brain is you that you need to show me that you're in that or the same breath that you get out you mean a state so he just introduced the word mistake he's about to develop this theme that enables lorenzo to admit some degree of involvement while minimizing his own role it's part of a package of techniques that in which you communicate to his suspect that i think you're a good person i understand what you've been through i sympathize with what you've been through often you hear normalizing statements like you know water if i were in your situation i would have done the same thing and all by the way i don't think you intended to do this i think it was an accident or maybe your friends put you up to it or maybe you were provoked there you need to kill that one resident. i don't think you're going to have a gun i don't want to jack the car into one that did the
communication moves in one direction it is designed to leave the person the suspect and think that the police don't think this is such a big deal right now and therefore i'll be treated with leniency ok so what are my choices either i can be the accomplice who refuses to speak or i can admit to what they want me to admit to given all of the minimisation that they've given me and enjoy the benefit of that but there are going to go. you. know how do you presume they're going to do that they look at how much they have communicated already he now knows so much about this crime that whether he was there or had anything to do with it or not he now knows enough about it to give you a description. and renzo why were you there. while you're a sleaze house was not. the reason you see this is no blow to keep your name here
for hours yesterday our man who kicked you in the head of course the building a story for him to tell. there is if you don't write ridge those shoes wrote part of the dre shoes. around so was it your in. your job is just right around he's now being set up so that when he's ready to give a statement he knows exactly what that statement should convey that he knows the gate he was kicked in the head shoe dragging her through the blood you know he's got it all so later a judge and a jury is going to watch the final confession and they're going to be so impressed and unable to look past that because they keep on asking themselves what happened you know those things if he was in there right. stare me down oh. you made that up i just said.